Ulduar Feedback Thread

Marveen wrote:Saturday 11th July

Not a terribad raid if you consider we almost didn't have enough signups to do this with (late cancellations and disappearing reservists, etc). But we finished the place, so Monday is just Malygos. Nothing new in the raid - bosses were all killed in normal mode. End of review!

Well I shall do my review of Yoggy, Vexx, Freya and Mimiron

Freya (+ 1 Elder)
Truthfully, though on root duty I couldn't see any one who had them on at any given time, except for me, due to the whole mushrooms spouting, trees growing Freya and the numerous adds at any given time. Nor was I fully aware of what any of her buffs or Debuffs do, but I did enjoy it once we had her done and dusted and got a bit wiser of the fit now.

Mimiron
I was left to tank the head on P3 and, hopefully, did it alright. Same as it was before I managed to die on a laser Barrage due to me running into it and getting all confused.

General. V
A new fight to me aswell, and I followed my orders, but still remained confused. I was hit the most by the shadow crash, but manage to step into the 'pools' left behind. I also out of stupidity avoided the green things, assuming they were some sort of horrible thing wondering around waiting to attack me. So when some one started shouting for the Cloud, I was unaware of what it was.

Yogg
Attempt 1: Taminak stands in clouds and summons masses of Guardians. Raid wipes.
Attempt 2: This time around I did the infamous Melee hunter move and stood on Sara, took down the big tenactles (the best i could) and freed who ever needed freeing.
The Purple lasers were annoying to say the least. I kept turning, avoiding and turning around to be hit by them a second time. So not good. Yogg himself seemed to be just a shoot at will, IF they were no guardians or guardians were on low HP

To conclude,
I -may- have wiped the raid, well I did... BUT I have now done a full run of Ulduar, got some experience to it and now know what to do, when to do it and hopefully didn't blunder too much in the two nights.

Taminak wrote:Freya (+ 1 Elder)
Truthfully, though on root duty I couldn't see any one who had them on at any given time, except for me, due to the whole mushrooms spouting, trees growing Freya and the numerous adds at any given time. Nor was I fully aware of what any of her buffs or Debuffs do, but I did enjoy it once we had her done and dusted and got a bit wiser of the fit now.

If you use any unitframes other than the default, rooted/strangled/tentacled/etc people tend to be shown with a highlight. Otherwise watch for people with raid icons, they're usually buffed/debuffed. Short of that, do a /tar Strengthened macro and hit it every now and then when people get rooted.

Taminak wrote:General. V
A new fight to me aswell, and I followed my orders, but still remained confused. I was hit the most by the shadow crash, but manage to step into the 'pools' left behind. I also out of stupidity avoided the green things, assuming they were some sort of horrible thing wondering around waiting to attack me. So when some one started shouting for the Cloud, I was unaware of what it was.

That's why you should read the tactics/watch the videos before a new boss the rest of us has seen! Jheera hit over 7k dps when she used the black puddles right at the start - this is a fight that favours ranged as they're not on interrupt duty (usually) and they only have to move to dodge shadowcrashes.

The DPS on the adds from the ranged seemed slow on our Yogg-Saron kill. I don't know if this was because they were attacking the boss or some other problem. But Tell has proved before that it is possible for there to be only one ranged killing adds and no more than two adds at a time.

One of our slowest kills because melee were constantly having to turn to help kill adds.

Aside from that the raid was ok.

In addition to this I also apologize for my failures on Mimiron. I blame base health.

Dahlaine wrote:The DPS on the adds from the ranged seemed slow on our Yogg-Saron kill. I don't know if this was because they were attacking the boss or some other problem. But Tell has proved before that it is possible for there to be only one ranged killing adds and no more than two adds at a time.

One of our slowest kills because melee were constantly having to turn to help kill adds.

Aside from that the raid was ok.

Yes, but Tell has done it before, Has exceptionally good gear and has raided with you more times then myself. So lets not go comparing people who are on two totally different pars.

Taminak wrote:

Dahlaine wrote:The DPS on the adds from the ranged seemed slow on our Yogg-Saron kill. I don't know if this was because they were attacking the boss or some other problem. But Tell has proved before that it is possible for there to be only one ranged killing adds and no more than two adds at a time.

One of our slowest kills because melee were constantly having to turn to help kill adds.

Aside from that the raid was ok.

Yes, but Tell has done it before, Has exceptionally good gear and has raided with you more times then myself. So lets not go comparing people who are on two totally different pars.

It was not meant to be an attack on you, I apologize that you interpreted it as such. I was merely stating my feedback for the raid as a whole; there were two ranged DPSers and add-killing was slow. I understand that it was your first attempt at the boss. I was merely pointing out where progress can be made. If it is as simple as a gear issue then that's fine, like I said I don't know the issue was - I'm just interested in see where we can improve and how we can do it.

Dahlaine wrote:

Taminak wrote:

Dahlaine wrote:The DPS on the adds from the ranged seemed slow on our Yogg-Saron kill. I don't know if this was because they were attacking the boss or some other problem. But Tell has proved before that it is possible for there to be only one ranged killing adds and no more than two adds at a time.

One of our slowest kills because melee were constantly having to turn to help kill adds.

Aside from that the raid was ok.

Yes, but Tell has done it before, Has exceptionally good gear and has raided with you more times then myself. So lets not go comparing people who are on two totally different pars.

It was not meant to be an attack on you, I apologize that you interpreted it as such. I was merely stating my feedback for the raid as a whole; there were two ranged DPSers and add-killing was slow. I understand that it was your first attempt at the boss. I was merely pointing out where progress can be made. If it is as simple as a gear issue then that's fine, like I said I don't know the issue was - I'm just interested in see where we can improve and how we can do it.

Well the problem is that it was myself and Jheera at ranged, both with some 'handicap' in battle, so it had to be aimed at me in some form. But as stated it fell down to mostly gear and experience (with class included) on the battle.
I admit that I wasn't on the adds 80% of the time, as I didn't deem them a problem at the time, but clearly if it is important to get rid of the adds aswell then I learn from my mistakes.
On that note aswell, I had a rather small panic attack numerous of times, incase my insanity dropped to zero, so constantly kept re-newing my sanity levels.

Aye, bear in mind that I was quite surprised to manage it myself as the sole ranged person too!

Things I have learned at Yoghurt...

Although it seems superficially a nice idea to stand in the restoring-sanity beam, it's not a good idea, since it dinks your damage by quite a lot.

Pet can happily be sicced on Yoghurt and left to it; almost all your own time can easily be consumed pewpewing adds, though when each one goes down you may well get time to chuck a Kill Shot in on Yoggy before going back to pewpewing adds.

You can of course stand almost in Yoggy with your back to him which gives maximum easy no-sanity-loss DPS time on the adds, though that does make the kill shots harder to chuck in!

It's a right confusing bugger of a fight the first time you see it.

Taminak wrote:

Dahlaine wrote:

Taminak wrote:

Dahlaine wrote:The DPS on the adds from the ranged seemed slow on our Yogg-Saron kill. I don't know if this was because they were attacking the boss or some other problem. But Tell has proved before that it is possible for there to be only one ranged killing adds and no more than two adds at a time.

One of our slowest kills because melee were constantly having to turn to help kill adds.

Aside from that the raid was ok.

Yes, but Tell has done it before, Has exceptionally good gear and has raided with you more times then myself. So lets not go comparing people who are on two totally different pars.

It was not meant to be an attack on you, I apologize that you interpreted it as such. I was merely stating my feedback for the raid as a whole; there were two ranged DPSers and add-killing was slow. I understand that it was your first attempt at the boss. I was merely pointing out where progress can be made. If it is as simple as a gear issue then that's fine, like I said I don't know the issue was - I'm just interested in see where we can improve and how we can do it.

Well the problem is that it was myself and Jheera at ranged, both with some 'handicap' in battle, so it had to be aimed at me in some form. But as stated it fell down to mostly gear and experience (with class included) on the battle.
I admit that I wasn't on the adds 80% of the time, as I didn't deem them a problem at the time, but clearly if it is important to get rid of the adds aswell then I learn from my mistakes.
On that note aswell, I had a rather small panic attack numerous of times, incase my insanity dropped to zero, so constantly kept re-newing my sanity levels.

Seriously. Get a grip.

Dahl meant no harm by his comments, if anything it was an perfectly clear and concise observation of the fight.

You need to learn to be less touchy about everything that's said, this is the tinterwebs after all.

Forum etiquette

D

I think...I'm getting it, finally. I can see an improvement, anyway, doing over 3000DPS on all but Thorim is, I think, pretty good for me. I'm starting to feel more comfortable about things, and now I've finally gotten over my hit cap, I can start gemming spellpower (finally!). Having seen (and killed) a couple of hardmodes I'd never done before, that's given me a bit of confidence, which is great.

Thorim is the one I need to work on more, so not to run about like a headless chicken.

Nothing much to add, well done Murlocs All.

/*grebbit*

I think tonight was my best raid with you lot. I of course messed up a ton of times, but hoping to rectify that ASAP. Part-raid healing on Hodir along with Zuzu was a nice feeling, and just took concentration.

I don't like Thorim, though. I know that under the balcony is supposed to be the best place for healers to stand, but I think it created more problems than solutions for me. Backed up against the wall created funny camera angles, which meant that I almost missed some lightning charges, which made me panic when I finally saw it, and missed one altogether, causing a wipe. Is it a raid group rule that I have to stand under there? Because honestly, I think I'd have more luck out in the field, standing with some of the ranged. If I miss a lightning charge, the movement of ranged would hopefully bring me to my senses.

Rynar wrote:I think tonight was my best raid with you lot. I of course messed up a ton of times, but hoping to rectify that ASAP. Part-raid healing on Hodir along with Zuzu was a nice feeling, and just took concentration.

I don't like Thorim, though. I know that under the balcony is supposed to be the best place for healers to stand, but I think it created more problems than solutions for me. Backed up against the wall created funny camera angles, which meant that I almost missed some lightning charges, which made me panic when I finally saw it, and missed one altogether, causing a wipe. Is it a raid group rule that I have to stand under there? Because honestly, I think I'd have more luck out in the field, standing with some of the ranged. If I miss a lightning charge, the movement of ranged would hopefully bring me to my senses.

I'm relatively sure D does his own thing on Thorim as well because of similar issues. However I may be mistaken about that I just vaguely remember him mentioning that the balcony wasn't a good place.

Rynar wrote:I know that under the balcony is supposed to be the best place for healers to stand, but I think it created more problems than solutions for me. Backed up against the wall created funny camera angles, which meant that I almost missed some lightning charges, which made me panic when I finally saw it, and missed one altogether, causing a wipe. Is it a raid group rule that I have to stand under there? Because honestly, I think I'd have more luck out in the field, standing with some of the ranged. If I miss a lightning charge, the movement of ranged would hopefully bring me to my senses.

You don't have to stand there, I find it's easier because there's only 2 pylons you have to worry about, they're wide apart, and you can just strafe out of their way. Best way to fix the camera thing is to zoom in a bit (not max camera distance or you get blinded by the lights around the edge of the balcony) and turn your back to the tanks. You don't need to be facing your targets to heal... :p

More feedback to come.

Thursday 17th July

Had a go at normal 25-man Flame Leviathan - did it with 11 players. No bike, 4 demolishers and 2 Siege Engines. The Demo passengers were 3 casters (Baglor, Jheera and Marv). Hardest bit was probably the run up as we realised the dwarves and gauntlet trash hit a bit harder than in the 10-man mode. Also, damage taken while killing turrets was not inconsiderable. Still, easy oneshot kill and some new shinies.

Flame Leviathan, XT-002, Iron Council: see Hard Mode thread.

Kologarn: Only 9 people got beamed this try - remember there's an achievement for not getting caught in the beams! I saw several ranged running on some of the beams - remember that if you spread out you will know exactly who he's targeting.

Auriaya: see Hard Mode thread for discussion on the [Crazy Cat Lady] tries. She was a bit moody, and liked to instagank healers on the pull. Seems a bit too random - could it be our starting spot that bugs her out, or is aggro really sensitive at the start of the pull? I have a feeling it's the place we're standing that bugs her. I just hate being ganked before I start casting my heals.. >.<

Hodir, Thorim: see Hard Mode thread.

Why you are getting ganked at Auriaya? You are too far away.

The cat's leap are like charge - it has a deadzone. And you lot keep insisting on standing almost at the far wall

Ideal position is for everyone to stand on top of one another 1 step behind the tank. No further.

I stood right behind Cardinal and got ganked by a melee swing from Auriaya, not the sentries. She slapped me so fast it didn't even record on Recount! I suspect it has to do with the height of the Tree of Life, because I've had the issue in the past even if standing right on Cardinal - only thing that seems to mitigate it is Shadowmelding before the pull, but then Zuzu gets ganked..

Mnemo wrote:Ideal position is for everyone to stand on top of one another 1 step behind the tank. No further.

Speaking of deadzones... *cough*

But, yeah, not TOO spread out is a cunning ploy indeed.